difficulties suggestions vista

This post is not neant to criticize, after all this is a beta. However, before I take Vista off my machine, I wanted to pass along what I found difficult about the current state of the OS. These comments are more intended for Microsoft staff than general members of the group.
1. User account control: In it's current iteration, I believe this will be turned off immediately by most users. Especially vexing is the repeated questions about programs that load at startup; for example, logitech keyboard and mouse drivers and ezarmor security. This caused the time to boot to a usable OS to hit an astronomical 4-5 minutes!
2. Windows firewall was still blocking programs after it had been turned off. It apparently blocked me from uploading to Flikr, even though I had turned it off.
3. The Poker gadget caused lots of problems, including an error message about Windows having trouble with the gadget that showed up on every shutdown.
4. I hate the fact that I can't alternately boot to a Win XP drive on startup. Might be my fault for not carefully setting up the dual boot. The whole dual boot thing seems to need work.
5. The default programs setup is a joke. Nobody will bve able to figure out how to use this and all it will do is get people complaining to the DOJ.
6. More wireless network card drivers should be included with the OS. Just a suggestion if it can be worked out with the manufacturers. I did find it amusing that the Microsoft network card (MN-710) could only be gotten from an update AFTER the machine was online.
7. Cntl-Alt-Del does not always function and programs that are told to shutdown do not always do so. Hey...it's a beta.
8. The Firefox plugin finder, while trying to install a Flash extension, killed the OS resulting in a reboot.
9. Various other small problems resulted in restart after restart.
10. I had lots of problems with my wireless mouse and keyboard (Loditech DiNovo and MX1000). The problems began at install, where I had to break out an old wired mouse and keyboard. After installation, the OS still failed to recognize the mouse and I had to switch to an MX900.
My general impression is that Vista looks nice and makes some improvements over XP, but it still needs a lot of work. The new security features are mostly irritating in their current implementation. The new explorer is very nice and easy to navigate. I'm looking forward to the next beta or RC.
One final comment: there are rumors about different versionbs and pricing, and I think there are too many versions and that the rumored price of Ultimate will turn customers off.
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Please forward to MS via the feedback link. This is not a managed newsgroup and there is little likelihood that your thoughts will reach MS here.
"ogman" wrote in message

This post is not neant to criticize, after all this is a beta. However, before I take Vista off my machine, I wanted to pass along what I found difficult about the current state of the OS. These comments are more intended for Microsoft staff than general members of the group.
1. User account control: In it's current iteration, I believe this will be turned off immediately by most users. Especially vexing is the repeated questions about programs that load at startup; for example, logitech keyboard and mouse drivers and ezarmor security. This caused the time to boot to a usable OS to hit an astronomical 4-5 minutes!
2. Windows firewall was still blocking programs after it had been turned off. It apparently blocked me from uploading to Flikr, even though I had turned it off.
3. The Poker gadget caused lots of problems, including an error message about Windows having trouble with the gadget that showed up on every shutdown.
4. I hate the fact that I can't alternately boot to a Win XP drive on startup. Might be my fault for not carefully setting up the dual boot. The whole dual boot thing seems to need work.
5. The default programs setup is a joke. Nobody will bve able to figure out how to use this and all it will do is get people complaining to the DOJ.
6. More wireless network card drivers should be included with the OS. Just a suggestion if it can be worked out with the manufacturers. I did find it amusing that the Microsoft network card (MN-710) could only be gotten from an update AFTER the machine was online.
7. Cntl-Alt-Del does not always function and programs that are told to shutdown do not always do so. Hey...it's a beta.
8. The Firefox plugin finder, while trying to install a Flash extension, killed the OS resulting in a reboot.
9. Various other small problems resulted in restart after restart.
10. I had lots of problems with my wireless mouse and keyboard (Loditech DiNovo and MX1000). The problems began at install, where I had to break out an old wired mouse and keyboard. After installation, the OS still failed to recognize the mouse and I had to switch to an MX900.
My general impression is that Vista looks nice and makes some improvements over XP, but it still needs a lot of work. The new security features are mostly irritating in their current implementation. The new explorer is very nice and easy to navigate. I'm looking forward to the next beta or RC.
One final comment: there are rumors about different versionbs and pricing, and I think there are too many versions and that the rumored price of Ultimate will turn customers off.
---------------- This post is a suggestion for Microsoft, and Microsoft responds to the suggestions with the most votes. To vote for this suggestion, click the "I Agree" button in the message pane. If you do not see the button, follow this link to open the suggestion in the Microsoft Web-based Newsreader and then click "I Agree" in the message pane.
http://windowshelp.microsoft.com/communities/newsgroups/en-us/default.mspx?mid=ef3dbcb4-891e-4de1-9304-364bffd00dbf&dg=microsoft.public.windows.vista.general

Everyone is entitled to their opinions....thanks for sharing yours.
1) Yes, UAC as default is tricky at best. Even when "toned down"/disabled I have run into MANY annoyances. Particularly deleting files from an earlier Windows Installation. 2) I have not run into that, but not saying you are wrong. 3) I have not had any problems with the Poker game in x86..well accept that I lost to often..just like real poker. 4) I expect install/upgrade/dual boot, etc will undergo major changes from here on out. This build was feature complete, not necessarily feature correct. ;-) 5) Have not looked athe default program setup...isn't it the same thing that they had to add to XP due to (one of the many) monopoly settlements? 6) Actually this is determined by the manufacturer of the hardware. When I worked at a major player in the digital webcam market we had LONG discussions wether having our driver ship with Windows was worth the legal contract needed to sign to be included on the disk. Another issue is timing, if you don't have a driver available when they freeze the disk, you and your customers are out of luck. I expect there will be tons more by the time Vista ships(if the driver model does not change) 7) Have not run into that issue. 8) Sounds like your app(Firefox) was able to get farther into the OS than it was supposed to. It is a tough line, if they follow the rules, they often get stuck by UAC or other security issues(kinda like having to install apps as admin) 9) I have never had a reboot issue during basic Windows tasks. I have had Oblivion freeze 3 times in over 40 hours of gameplay. 10) I am luckily using a Microsoft Mouse-Keyboard combo..but since it is recognized as a standard USB HID device (or HID compliant consumer control device) it has no special drivers to cause trouble.
I have not heard any other pricing suggestions besides similar to Xp with Ultimate(being an amazing bundle of stuff) being much higher. Ultimate is not meant for the average consumer...it is meant for the techno who buys a new machine every year or so, or upgrades every component every couple of months.

"ogman" wrote in message

This post is not neant to criticize, after all this is a beta. However, before I take Vista off my machine, I wanted to pass along what I found difficult about the current state of the OS. These comments are more intended for Microsoft staff than general members of the group.
1. User account control: In it's current iteration, I believe this will be turned off immediately by most users. Especially vexing is the repeated questions about programs that load at startup; for example, logitech keyboard and mouse drivers and ezarmor security. This caused the time to boot to a usable OS to hit an astronomical 4-5 minutes!
2. Windows firewall was still blocking programs after it had been turned off. It apparently blocked me from uploading to Flikr, even though I had turned it off.
3. The Poker gadget caused lots of problems, including an error message about Windows having trouble with the gadget that showed up on every shutdown.
4. I hate the fact that I can't alternately boot to a Win XP drive on startup. Might be my fault for not carefully setting up the dual boot. The whole dual boot thing seems to need work.
5. The default programs setup is a joke. Nobody will bve able to figure out how to use this and all it will do is get people complaining to the DOJ.
6. More wireless network card drivers should be included with the OS. Just a suggestion if it can be worked out with the manufacturers. I did find it amusing that the Microsoft network card (MN-710) could only be gotten from an update AFTER the machine was online.
7. Cntl-Alt-Del does not always function and programs that are told to shutdown do not always do so. Hey...it's a beta.
8. The Firefox plugin finder, while trying to install a Flash extension, killed the OS resulting in a reboot.
9. Various other small problems resulted in restart after restart.
10. I had lots of problems with my wireless mouse and keyboard (Loditech DiNovo and MX1000). The problems began at install, where I had to break out an old wired mouse and keyboard. After installation, the OS still failed to recognize the mouse and I had to switch to an MX900.
My general impression is that Vista looks nice and makes some improvements over XP, but it still needs a lot of work. The new security features are mostly irritating in their current implementation. The new explorer is very nice and easy to navigate. I'm looking forward to the next beta or RC.
One final comment: there are rumors about different versionbs and pricing, and I think there are too many versions and that the rumored price of Ultimate will turn customers off.
---------------- This post is a suggestion for Microsoft, and Microsoft responds to the suggestions with the most votes. To vote for this suggestion, click the "I Agree" button in the message pane. If you do not see the button, follow this link to open the suggestion in the Microsoft Web-based Newsreader and then click "I Agree" in the message pane.
http://windowshelp.microsoft.com/communities/newsgroups/en-us/default.mspx?mid=ef3dbcb4-891e-4de1-9304-364bffd00dbf&dg=microsoft.public.windows.vista.general